Art Department Moving

Date: Apr 20, 2004

Art Department Moving

Date: Apr 20, 2004

They really are trying give meaning to the phrase Hardy Street High/

Date: Apr 20, 2004

Sounds just like nursing going to Albertson's, and we know how that worked out. If you read the piece, it is years away at best. Sounds like PR to me. How would students get to class?

Date: Apr 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Flash Gordon
"Sounds just like nursing going to Albertson's, and we know how that worked out. If you read the piece, it is years away at best. Sounds like PR to me. How would students get to class?"

The trolleys?

Date: Apr 20, 2004

divide and conquer

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
"divide and conquer"

That is EXACTLY what I thought. Exactly!

But I have a question about this. It's one thing to have to walk from OMH to the Science Tower for classes. How will students, especially freshmen and sophomores (who are taking core classes in a variety of disciplines in a variety of buildings) be able to leave a College Hall class at 9:15 to be on time for an art class downtown at 9:30, and then back, say, to LAB for an English Class at 11:00.

Putting a whole department so far away from campus makes very little sense to me. The department and its senior-level students might like it, but I doubt freshmen and sophomores will.

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
"divide and conquer"

Considering the story recently told on this board of Shelby insulting a future USM art student at a banquet, his disdain for the arts is noted.

Could this be a way of weeding out the "undesirable" majors? If students have to drive downtown to take a class, it will be a burden, and fewer students will take art classes. Then Shelby can argue for phasing out the arts program with "Heck, it's not a productive department anyway. Look how enrollment has declined in the past X years. Let's chop it."

IOW, by placing a the commute-burden on students, fewer students will take art classes. Since fewer students will take art classes, then SFT can make the argument to "phase out" art.

Maybe SFT's making room for the new casino college.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

Here's a question: Has anyone on this message board actually SEEN the old Hatt. High school lately? The
Thames's regime is talking about it "will take about
$12 million to fix it." Fix it? The darn thing is a "money pit" worse than the Trolley fiasco.

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: wary undergrad
"Here's a question: Has anyone on this message board actually SEEN the old Hatt. High school lately? The Thames's regime is talking about it "will take about $12 million to fix it." Fix it? The darn thing is a "money pit" worse than the Trolley fiasco. "

Here's a photo:

Date: Apr 20, 2004

Thanks, FS

Date: Apr 20, 2004

Let me go on the record right now by saying that I think USM has an awesome, talented, and tremendously underappreciated Art Dept. Removing them to the old HHS site only reinforces the idea that when individuals are involved in tenure and promotion decisions, the fact that they are at least 10 good minutes from the general campus will weigh heavily on them.

Take it from one who knows.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: wary undergrad
"Here's a question: Has anyone on this message board actually SEEN the old Hatt. High school lately? The
Thames's regime is talking about it "will take about
$12 million to fix it." Fix it? The darn thing is a "money pit" worse than the Trolley fiasco. "

Correction on the amount it will cost to fix this prize up- $15 million.

I do believe that Thames's cheese has finally slid off his cracker. The govt. cheese, that is.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
"Let me go on the record right now by saying that I think USM has an awesome, talented, and tremendously underappreciated Art Dept. Removing them to the old HHS site only reinforces the idea that when individuals are involved in tenure and promotion decisions, the fact that they are at least 10 good minutes from the general campus will weigh heavily on them.

I couldn't agree more, educator

Date: Apr 20, 2004

This administration seems to come up with a new idea every few weeks. What has actually come to fruition in the past two years?

Date: Apr 20, 2004

I have said for years that I hope something becomes of that building. It was an antique store for a while, but turning it into the art dept.? does it even have air/heat? Last time I was in there, it was about falling apart.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

I understand that the building has an asbestos problem and will cost a fortune to renovate. But since we've saved 1.6 million from the reorganization, we can handle it -

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
"Let me go on the record right now by saying that I think USM has an awesome, talented, and tremendously underappreciated Art Dept. Removing them to the old HHS site only reinforces the idea that when individuals are involved in tenure and promotion decisions, the fact that they are at least 10 good minutes from the general campus will weigh heavily on them. Take it from one who knows."

Yep, I agree.

Another problem with an off-campus Arts college: Students at USM have always been able to visit the fabulous on-campus exhibits. Now, students will be less inclined to do so, if exhibits are held at the downtown location. I really pity USM's students--it is so sad that the opportunities for cultural and intellectual enrichment are being killed or removed from campus--the forum being discontinued and the Arts college being moved. Sad.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Anonymous
"I understand that the building has an asbestos problem and will cost a fortune to renovate. But since we've saved 1.6 million from the reorganization, we can handle it - "

Old schools often make excellent environments for artists and studios for lots of reasons. And one could make a case that you could locate student artists in worse environments than downtown where their energy and work can have a profound effect on the "feel" of downtown. Not to mention we might see a real interesting growth of galleries and eating places and maybe even a real art store. So it might not be so bad.

On the other hand, there are problems to overcome. Transportation. Class schedules, money. But these can be overcome if the idea is good and the art people as well as the town and university are behind it.

The one slight concern I have has to do with the meanings of space and placement. None of the arts areas are centered on the campus -- they are all at the fringes. Spinning the art department down into the city can enhance the department's visibility off campus while lowering it on campus. USM students, sad to say, are pretty underexposed to cultural life -- not only high culture but artmaking in general even in terms of popular culture. It would be sad if the result of this movement would be to further isolate the average USM student from USM art students. And I'd also add the reverse is true as well -- I worry about creating an environment that further encourages an art "elite."

The tendency (even at the High School levels ) to create "magnets" for specialized acitivities only serves to give modern "educators" the excuse not to spend time or money on exposing the average students to those activities. After all. if we spend all of our physical education resources on producing great athletic teams, why spend the money on the average student who should have a good phys ed program. If we create arts magnet high schools, why spend money on arts programs for non-arts students?

Mississippi students are being ripped off when it comes to a real education. The kind of education that is really portable (meaning can travel beyond Mississippi) familiarizes and prepares students not only with the basic tools (reading, writing, and 'rithmatic) but with broader cultural experiences that enable them to move with some facilitiy into another state or another country. A good education should give a student the basic skills and experience to cross over boundries of class, religion, and nationality. A good education should prepare students to speak more than one language -- we talk about preparing students for the global culture but too many students from our public system have no facility with any other language but English.

The advantage that the rich have is this -- they can get that kind of education naturally. If you are wealthy enough you don't need a great school . . . travel, experience and exposure to culture are often so much a part of wealth that it doesn't take commitment or effort.

The idea of the best public education is to expose those who don't have the advantages of the wealthy to at least some of the things the wealthy take for granted. And this is how our state's leaders sell Mississippi children short -- their dreams for MIssissippi's children are too small, their expectations too low.

When I came to USM just six short years ago I thought that this state was beginning to transcend that kind of thinking. I am not ready to give up quite yet -- but we have slid a long way back down the hill. And those who lose aren't Mississippi's elite, but MIssissippi's poor and middle class who aren't encouraged, cajoled or flattered into believeing that they can have more than they presently have.

With all the talent that is here, it is incredibly frustrating to see it, if not wasted, at least not always find its level.

My challenge to those of you who are students is to make the very most of what you have (and there is still a great deal). But while you are doing that demand MORE -- for yourselves, for your peers, for your little brothers and sisters and cousins and, perhaps eventually, for your children. Demand more of each other -- demand more of your faculty. But don't settle for a paper alone -- a sheepskin in the long run is only really worth the quality of the experiences you had in getting it; the people you met and loved and learned from; the standards you set for yourself and met and those you failed to meet; the way your successes and failures made you wiser and smarter and more resourceful and better able to see what mark you want to leave on the world around you.

Sorry to pontificate. I'm not really a fan of Haley Barbour but I agree with his campaign slogan -- we can do better.

This community (and it is a community) has been amazing. Whatever happens in the next few weeks the energy here and the thinking here need to find form and expression in the university community in all those ordinary ways a university runs -- in class, in discussions, in committee meetings, at athletic events.

The diversity in this group (right and left, liberal-conservative and moderate, young and not so young, faculty/student/staff/alum -- I could go on) -- is its strength. In many many ways these conversations have given me huge encouragement in our time of trouble.

Once more: carpe diem.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

I nominate present professor for commencement speaker. Every year. Forever.

Wonderful, inspirational comments.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: foot soldier
"I nominate present professor for commencement speaker. Every year. Forever. Wonderful, inspirational comments. "

ah, shucks, Foot Soldier, that is really nice.

Hey -- I love your handle. It conveys a sense of someone willing to be in the front line, to put self out in front with little hope of recognition or reward save what comes from winning the good fight. I can really respect that. We're foot soldiers, all of us -- and all the little foot soldiers make one great army.

Best wishes!

Date: Apr 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Watching News
" Heard it was a Ken Malone (of Trolley car fame) deal."

Yup, Kenbot was at the podium!

Date: Apr 20, 2004

Is anybody out there familiar with the campus of the renowned

Savannah College of At and Design? They have restored delapidated

buildings all over the city for classroom and studio space, and it has

proven to be a mutually beneficial arrangement. I see no reason why

Hattiesburg and USM couldn't have a similar symbiotic relationship.

It's definitly thinking outside the box, but I would expect no less in the

way of creativity from USM's art department!

Please don't dis this idea just because it might seem at first read to

be a part of Shelby's "divide and conquer" stratagy. Actually, the

idea of USM fine arts at the old high school pre-dates the Thames

administration by several years. I can remember Mary Ann Stringer

mentioning it, maybe even before she was dean.

While I may be "off campus" as that idiot Klumb catagorizes us,

I am no supporter of Shelby Thames. Though I hate to see his

administration get credit for it, this idea has merit.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

hear, hear - usm/downtown supported. I posted this on another string but felt it was relevant to this one...

There were many many many people involved in work with the old high school LONG before Ken Malone ever came to town. There have been discussions for a long time about a university presence downtown. If anyone deserves any credit for the positive things happening downtown, especially persuading the university to FINALLY establish a presence downtown it's Bernice Linton. Kudos to Bernice.

You give Malone too much credit. From what I hear he might have business experience but having experience in an area doesn't mean your good at it (as evidenced from posters on this board in regards to the way he treats people).

I agree that he must have some personal gain. I was told recently by a reliable source that he was recently overheard bragging about how many people he recently fired. He gets off on the power, not on doing good work.

Date: Apr 20, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: USM supporter/downtown supporter
" Is anybody out there familiar with the campus of the renowned Savannah College of At and Design? They have restored delapidated buildings all over the city for classroom and studio space, and it has proven to be a mutually beneficial arrangement. I see no reason why Hattiesburg and USM couldn't have a similar symbiotic relationship. It's definitly thinking outside the box, but I would expect no less in the way of creativity from USM's art department! Please don't dis this idea just because it might seem at first read to be a part of Shelby's "divide and conquer" stratagy. Actually, the idea of USM fine arts at the old high school pre-dates the Thames administration by several years. I can remember Mary Ann Stringer mentioning it, maybe even before she was dean. While I may be "off campus" as that idiot Klumb catagorizes us, I am no supporter of Shelby Thames. Though I hate to see his administration get credit for it, this idea has merit. "

I agree. I have been there and have friends who teach there. Hell, I even got a travel mug with with the SCAD logo!

Anyway I think there are lots of good possibilities too. The one difference i want to point out is that the entire SCAD is downtown, not just a piece of it. I am still concerned about how amputating the art department from the rest of the campus is going to affect the campus and it's mission to provide a broad educational experience for its students.

But you are right USM supporter, this could be very exciting. I think on this issue we should try to see it from several different angles to try to determine how best to take advantage of the opportunity while solving the problems it might create.

Is here anybody from art and design, especially faculty, who can speak to this? Was Art aware of this initiative?

Date: Apr 22, 2004

I though I should post something, since I'm familiar with the Department of Art. Most of the faculty are excited about moving downtown. We have tried for many, many years to distinguish ourselves from music and theater. It has been extremely difficult. The music programs at USM are stellar as well as our theatrical performances. It's hard to get similar recognition for the visual arts. It has long been discussed about making the Department of the Art more accessible to the community. Our first attempt was the Community Arts School, which has been disbanded ( A horrible idea in my opinion). The Visual arts programs moving downtown would probably be the Graphic Communication Program, Drawing and Painting, Art Education and perhaps Museum Studies. Art Appreciation classes would still have to be offered at the main campus.

In case you are not familiar, studio art classes last for two hours MWF and 2 and 3/4 hours two days a week. Our studio classes (expecially those pesky freshman classes) are tradionally offered at 8:00 - 10:00 and then 10:00 -12:00, with another course in the afternoon on Tuesday and Thursday. Therefore a freshman or sophmore student would spend thier morning downtown at the renovated structure and be able to get a bite to eat at one of the great restaurants downtown and then bike or catch a ride back to campus for other courses in the afternoon. Art students schedule Art couses first and then schedule thier other courses around those. An art student is not encouraged to take more than three studio courses a semester, it definately leads to overload. Hope this helps aleviate your concerned about this project. Thuly we believe in the power of creativity and transformation and artist value the ability to look at something from several different viewpoints. We chose to see this as an opportunity to exhibit our creativity and drive.

Date: Apr 22, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: concerned
"I though I should post something, since I'm familiar with the Department of Art. Most of the faculty are excited about moving downtown. We have tried for many, many years to distinguish ourselves from music and theater. It has been extremely difficult. The music programs at USM are stellar as well as our theatrical performances. It's hard to get similar recognition for the visual arts. It has long been discussed about making the Department of the Art more accessible to the community. Our first attempt was the Community Arts School, which has been disbanded ( A horrible idea in my opinion). The Visual arts programs moving downtown would probably be the Graphic Communication Program, Drawing and Painting, Art Education and perhaps Museum Studies. Art Appreciation classes would still have to be offered at the main campus. In case you are not familiar, studio art classes last for two hours MWF and 2 and 3/4 hours two days a week. Our studio classes (expecially those pesky freshman classes) are tradionally offered at 8:00 - 10:00 and then 10:00 -12:00, with another course in the afternoon on Tuesday and Thursday. Therefore a freshman or sophmore student would spend thier morning downtown at the renovated structure and be able to get a bite to eat at one of the great restaurants downtown and then bike or catch a ride back to campus for other courses in the afternoon. Art students schedule Art couses first and then schedule thier other courses around those. An art student is not encouraged to take more than three studio courses a semester, it definately leads to overload. Hope this helps aleviate your concerned about this project. Thuly we believe in the power of creativity and transformation and artist value the ability to look at something from several different viewpoints. We chose to see this as an opportunity to exhibit our creativity and drive."

I agree...I see this as a positive sign for the Art Dept.