Agreement has G & S out?

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Agreement has G & S out?

Date: Apr 30, 2004

I can see how you'd believe that, but on a more positive note - at least they were not TERMINATED. They could have resigned and been done with it - but they didn't and look what has been created. Those men have been through a lot. Shelby did not get his way, well, it won't be too much longer before the outcome is announced.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

I know what the agreement is, and I have not shared it beyond my immediate family. I intend to follow Justice Anderson's directive and keep the agreement confidential until the IHL makes it public. When that time comes I will be prepared to defend my actions. If there has been a breach of confidentiality, I know where it did not come from.

As background for understanding the settlement I'd suggest people look at what Gary and I were facing on March 5, 2004. We had been told in writing that our salary would stop on March 31 regardless of the status or our hearing. I was and am not old enough to collect Social Security. Gary was in the middle of a major book project. All the power and resources of the university, including Public Relations were aimed to destroy us. Our wives and families suffered greatly. The pressure continued for almost two months. We were in the media daily and often not in very flattering terms.

Keep all of that in mind when you review the many aspects of a very complicated settlement that was arrived at via the extraordinary talents and tireless efforts of Justice Anderson.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Why didnt G & S say all along all they were concerned about was that their actions not endanger their economic well-being? What was all this talk about academica freedeom and integrity?

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Now hold your horses, "alum." If you know so much about the details of the agreement, what was the source of your information? Do you have a direct line to the dome?

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: alum
"Why didnt G & S say all along all they were concerned about was that their actions not endanger their economic well-being? What was all this talk about academica freedeom and integrity?"

IF G&S have decided to resign, they have not done so without making a major contribution to the pursuit of academic freedom at USM. There is still much to be done, even beyond the Glamser and Stringer situation.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

This was never about the money, but people have to live their lives. G & S and their supporters are all about academic freedom. They didn't just resign, instead they stood up for themselves. They fought against being terminated and if they won that for themselves, then enough said on that matter.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

wait, aren't these postings anonymous? you know that was FG "confirming" it? i could be shelby thames or anyone typing away.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

As my grandmother used to say:

"until you've walked a mile in my shoes"

No one on this board can say what G&S should have done in terms of the settlement except them.

Please alum go back to eagletalk with your other Shelboids.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

alum- would you come back to USM and work for Shelby after all of this? I can honestly say that I don't think I would.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

I'm hearing rumors as well, and they are definatly about them retiring, matter of fact I hear that Frank and Gary invited a few friends over to celebrate after the hearing.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Not enuff said

Of their own volition G & S mde themselves standbearers of academic freedom and the fight against Thames -- then they bailed

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: alum
"I heard a rumour that the agreement has Glamser & Stringer agreeing to retire and getting two years salary."

First, I have said several times on this board that, even if reinstated, the professors would be utterly insane to return to work under a Thames administration. And until the IHL board makes its decision public, we must assume that there is and will be a Thames administration. In that vein, they did well to accept a payout & hit the road.

On the other hand, the whole concept that this went deeper than a simple personnel issue -- termination of two professors -- has been utterly trashed. On March 5, Thames requested they resign & in the end, that's what they did ... with a little money to sweeten the deal.

So, good people, Shelby got almost exactly what he wanted. And he avoided having to take his "evidence" into a bona fide court of law, where I believe it would have been utterly shredded.

But let's wait & see. If the recommendation does not include some form of sanction for Thames, then I'd offer we've all been hoodwinked. If it does, then all has not been for naught.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Oops ... forgot not.. "not retiring"

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: concerned
"I'm hearing rumors as well, and they are definatly about them retiring, matter of fact I hear that Frank and Gary invited a few friends over to celebrate after the hearing."

Did they go to Frank's or Gary's house?

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Frank Glamser
"I know what the agreement is, and I have not shared it beyond my immediate family. I intend to follow Justice Anderson's directive and keep the agreement confidential until the IHL makes it public. When that time comes I will be prepared to defend my actions. If there has been a breach of confidentiality, I know where it did not come from. As background for understanding the settlement I'd suggest people look at what Gary and I were facing on March 5, 2004. We had been told in writing that our salary would stop on March 31 regardless of the status or our hearing. I was and am not old enough to collect Social Security. Gary was in the middle of a major book project. All the power and resources of the university, including Public Relations were aimed to destroy us. Our wives and families suffered greatly. The pressure continued for almost two months. We were in the media daily and often not in very flattering terms. Keep all of that in mind when you review the many aspects of a very complicated settlement that was arrived at via the extraordinary talents and tireless efforts of Justice Anderson. "

I don't know you; I have never met you and, yet, I have supported you. I have supported you in words, in actions, and with finances. My support has been a gift...no strings, no regrets. You and Dr. Stringer were visible victims of this corrupt administration - not the first and, perhaps, likely not to be the last. Your proposed terminations created a rallying cry for a community to come together like it never has before - 40/0 and 430/32. The greater community in Hattiesburg, Mississippi, and beyond the state borders has become aware of the travesty in management at the University of Mississippi because of your joint suffering. I, for one, will never regret my support and will never question the decisions that you might have made in caring for yourself and your family. I beseech other supporters to express te same.

Fireshelby, please get out the troll zapper!

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: alum
"As I stated in original post - I heard a rumour and Glamser as much as confirmed it"

Once again, I'm puzzled. Is this a troll?

Why is Frank Glamser posting to an internet bulletin board a half hour before IHL meets to consider his personnel case. Shouldn't he be in Jackson?

Sorry, if it's really you Dr. Glamser, but if it were my future that was being discussed in an executive session, I'd darn sure be there. Or right outside the door.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: concerned
"definatly "

Definitely from EagleTalk.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

not sure... wich one... but I would hazard that it was Gary's.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Whatever the terms of the "settlement," Frank Glamser & Gary Stringer have done a great service to institution. For that, everyone -- faculty, alumni, the Hattiesburg comunity, and the taxpayers of my beloved state of Mississippi, should be grateful. There was a time when I said, jokingly of course, that it sould take the Teamsters Union could clean things up. But, thanks to Professors Glamser & Stringer, a bright new day is forthcoming. These two men have experienced an unbelievably high level of abuse during the past few months. Regardless of the terms of the settlement (to which, evidently, only "alum" is privy) they have my thanks. Thank you Professors Glamser & Stringer.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Never have been on EagleTalk

Never have supported Shelby

Seems like there is a rigid orthodoxy amongst many who OPPOSE the troll

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Salesperson
" I don't know you; I have never met you and, yet, I have supported you. I have supported you in words, in actions, and with finances. My support has been a gift...no strings, no regrets. You and Dr. Stringer were visible victims of this corrupt administration - not the first and, perhaps, likely not to be the last. Your proposed terminations created a rallying cry for a community to come together like it never has before - 40/0 and 430/32. The greater community in Hattiesburg, Mississippi, and beyond the state borders has become aware of the travesty in management at the University of Mississippi because of your joint suffering. I, for one, will never regret my support and will never question the decisions that you might have made in caring for yourself and your family. I beseech other supporters to express te same. Fireshelby, please get out the troll zapper!"

I should have put a salutation to Dr. Glamser. Obviously I meant the University of Southern Mississippi and the instead of te. Typing too fast, sorry. Invictus, I was referring to the troll who is being critical of an as yet undisclosed settlement agreement.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

"the professors would be utterly insane to return to work under a Thames administration. And until the IHL board makes its decision public, we must assume that there is and will be a Thames administration."

Couldn't be said better. Thanks Invictus!

Date: Apr 30, 2004

I would love for one of you great thinkers to please explain what "great service" G&S have done for USM by all the discontent they have caused through their wrong actions.

As it does appear that G&S have agreed to retire, as Dr. Thames had encouraged them to do back in March, it does appear to acknowledge that Anderson must have explained to them yesterday that based on Shelby's evidence that they, G&S, would most likly not prevail in this matter. In short their actions have been wrong!

All of you G&S supporters have claimed what a fair and just person Anderson represents (and I agree completely). Well, G&S are going and Shelby remains based on the agreement Anderson help design. Looks like in the end Shelby's right!

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Is the IHL meeting over? I'm amazed at the level of inside information some people have. And S'sR, if nothing else, S & G exposed the ugliness of the Thames administration. They are little people with mean little spirits and mean little minds.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

former - G & S exposed Thames admin as mean? Hardly it was well established already

Date: Apr 30, 2004

People close to USM knew they were mean, but I don't know if the larger community understood -- and I use "mean" also in its other connotation of grubby, small, etc.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: alum
"So faculty members who work for Shelby are insane? Land office business for psychiatrists in Hattiesburg My we defend our heroes blindly"

Yes, the one's who sit quitely & let Shelby rule are quite insane. But then there are what 32 or or so of those.

The majority 430 faculty are quite sane to be fighting for integrity in their work place.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Make that 428 fighting - two quit

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Note how I won't hide behind some fictitious name.

Dear Shelby's Right:

What good have Gary and Frank done? Well, do you mean in addition to their combined 56 years of service to the university? Which, for Gary's part at least, included at least one year as president of the Faculty Senate? Sitting on and chairing numerous hiring and tenure and promotion committees. Supervising the theses and dissertations of students (me among them)? Teaching literally thousands of students? Bringing over a million dollars to USM through external grants? Putting USM on the international map for humanities scholars by suggesting the Donne Variorum and then agreeing to be the general editor of it? A project, by the way, that has been deemed by the National Endowment for the Humanities as the most significant textual editing project in Renaissance literature and one that will be the model to be followed. Do you need more instances?

Shelby Thames, from all I've read, was an outstanding teacher and researcher in polymer science. But, once he was put in the Dome, what good has he wrought? He pushed through a reorganization without the support of the faculty; he fired 9 deans; he is personally responsible for the flight of over a hundred professors in his two--count 'em, 2--years in office. He has now publicly admitted to snooping on faculty and student email. He has summarily dismissed two longstanding faculty members with no evidence whatsover to prove his claims--at least that's my reading of what the emails said. And he has brought ridicule on USM and the state, all because he thought these two faculty were challenging his authority. How insecure can one man be?

If Gary and Frank do resign/retire, they have every right to. I wouldn't keep working in that environment? And I hope the rumor about the 2years pay is true--that would amount to a settlement package in the area of $250 thousand when you combine both salaries and benefits. And, frankly, that money should come from Thames's pocket, not the taxpayers'. My hope, however, is that Gary and Frank are reinstated and that the IHL will take up Thames's leadership at its May 20 meeting--and will summarily dismiss him.

Yours,

Ted Sherman

Professor of English, MTSU, Murfreesboro

Class of 93 (PhD)

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Invictus
" Once again, I'm puzzled. Is this a troll? Why is Frank Glamser posting to an internet bulletin board a half hour before IHL meets to consider his personnel case. Shouldn't he be in Jackson? Sorry, if it's really you Dr. Glamser, but if it were my future that was being discussed in an executive session, I'd darn sure be there. Or right outside the door."

posted by Frank (maybe?)

Did they go to Frank's or Gary's house?

Wouldn't Frank have said:

"Did they go to MINE or Gary's house?"

Date: Apr 30, 2004

HA has results online now, official

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: alum
"So faculty members who work for Shelby are insane?"

I didn't say that. I said that if those specific professors returned to work under a Thames administration they'd be insane. He tried to fire them. They'd be nuts to go back with him in the president's office.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Details of the settlement between the University of Southern Mississippi and professors Gary Stringer and Frank Glamser include:

- The university will recommend Angie Dvorak, vice president of research and economic development, will not pursue litigation against the professors.

- The university will withdraw its termination proceedings against the professors.

- The professors will be reinstated for two years. During those two years the professors can convert to consultants if they want.

- The university will support Stringer’s research project and will not oppose a request if he transfers the project to another institution.

- The professors agree the university will not provide office facilities or supplies on campus.

- The professors will not publicly criticize the administration.

- The professors will be allowed to remove their personal material from their campus offices.

- The professors will be compensated at their current nine-month salaries. At the end of the 2005-2006 school year, any obligations of employment will have been satisfied.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

settlement is posted and answer is

G & S did fold - they get the money remainder of USM faculty get Shelby

Oh what integrity

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Invictus
" Once again, I'm puzzled. Is this a troll? Why is Frank Glamser posting to an internet bulletin board a half hour before IHL meets to consider his personnel case. Shouldn't he be in Jackson? Sorry, if it's really you Dr. Glamser, but if it were my future that was being discussed in an executive session, I'd darn sure be there. Or right outside the door."

posted by Frank (maybe?)

Did they go to Frank's or Gary's house?

Wouldn't Frank have said:

"Did they go to MINE or Gary's house?"

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Ted Sherman
"Note how I won't hide behind some fictitious name. Dear Shelby's Right: What good have Gary and Frank done? Well, do you mean in addition to their combined 56 years of service to the university? Which, for Gary's part at least, included at least one year as president of the Faculty Senate? Sitting on and chairing numerous hiring and tenure and promotion committees. Supervising the theses and dissertations of students (me among them)? Teaching literally thousands of students? Bringing over a million dollars to USM through external grants? Putting USM on the international map for humanities scholars by suggesting the Donne Variorum and then agreeing to be the general editor of it? A project, by the way, that has been deemed by the National Endowment for the Humanities as the most significant textual editing project in Renaissance literature and one that will be the model to be followed. Do you need more instances? Shelby Thames, from all I've read, was an outstanding teacher and researcher in polymer science. But, once he was put in the Dome, what good has he wrought? He pushed through a reorganization without the support of the faculty; he fired 9 deans; he is personally responsible for the flight of over a hundred professors in his two--count 'em, 2--years in office. He has now publicly admitted to snooping on faculty and student email. He has summarily dismissed two longstanding faculty members with no evidence whatsover to prove his claims--at least that's my reading of what the emails said. And he has brought ridicule on USM and the state, all because he thought these two faculty were challenging his authority. How insecure can one man be? If Gary and Frank do resign/retire, they have every right to. I wouldn't keep working in that environment? And I hope the rumor about the 2years pay is true--that would amount to a settlement package in the area of $250 thousand when you combine both salaries and benefits. And, frankly, that money should come from Thames's pocket, not the taxpayers'. My hope, however, is that Gary and Frank are reinstated and that the IHL will take up Thames's leadership at its May 20 meeting--and will summarily dismiss him. Yours, Ted Sherman Professor of English, MTSU, Murfreesboro Class of 93 (PhD)"

Ted, great insights - you were taught well by great minds.

I'm a believer in the taxpayer not having to front the bill for Shelby's misdoings -- time for some sweeping reform.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

G & S have no problem with taxpayers paying - they approved the agreement

Date: Apr 30, 2004

And Thames received no sanctions or reprimand whatsoever. Well, good for the professors, I guess.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
" Ted, great insights - you were taught well by great minds. I'm a believer in the taxpayer not having to front the bill for Shelby's misdoings -- time for some sweeping reform."

Absolutely - support for cleaning house has just been strengthened - Phase II.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: alum
"Maybe Stringer can take his research to University of Manilla - a natural place for such a folder"

I guess SFT is not the only mean-spirited person at USM. This is uncalled-for. I'll bet people from ther schools are already calling him. If I weren't an English major, I'd be begging him to take his grant and his project someplace it will be appreciated.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Shelby needs no sanctions - he has been exposed as a terrible administrator that will stop at nothing to crush those that oppose him. Either two things will happen from now - the IHL rigs some sort of retirement/face-saving deal for Shelby to leave ASAP. OR, more likely, Shelby and his cronies will continue to run USM into the ground. Either way, I'm glad Gary and Frank make it out of this with their jobs and integrity still fully intact. God bless you both, Frank and Gary!!!

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Salesperson
" I don't know you; I have never met you and, yet, I have supported you. . . . . .The greater community in Hattiesburg, Mississippi, and beyond the state borders has become aware of the travesty in management at the University of Mississippi because of your joint suffering. I, for one, will never regret my support and will never question the decisions that you might have made in caring for yourself and your family. I beseech other supporters to express te same. Fireshelby, please get out the troll zapper!"

SALESPERSON: I agree wholeheartedly. I support these men and I believe in them. I'm not the one in front of the barrel of Shelby's gun. My respect is undiminished. They could have "bailed" months ago. They didn't. They have stood in the line of fire and accepted all the crap thrown at them by this administration. They don't owe me anything and I feel as though I owe them everything because without their willingness to find the truth we would not know what we know about this administration.

Thank you guys -- however it ends.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Under this agreement, Shelby has succeeded in stifling free speech. The professors have been exiled from campus. Their tenure was converted to a two year terminal contract. This is a sad day.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

S's Right,

You posts and analysis are quite annoying and incorrect. I am a practicing attorney who has been involved in many settlement negotiations. In my experience, you are simply wrong. No competent judge, mediator, arbitrator, etc. would hear the testimony of one side without any cross-examination or conflicting evidence and conclude that side's case is so strong that the other side should cave. It just doesn't work that way.

The push for a settlement was clearly motivated by the weakness of Thames' case. If the professors' agreed to retire, it was their choice based on what they thought was the best long term solution. Furthermore, if alum is correct, then Thames' wouldn't have agreed to pay them two years' salary.

Your earlier post about the AAUP and the ACLU footing the bill for the legal expenses of the professors is just wrong. Although you make lots of assertions about what the AAUP and the ACLU would do, you obviously have no real experience with how these organizations operate and fund litigation. I do have some experience and can tell you that they don't have the resources to donate to every case that happens to deal with freedom of speech or academic freedom. Therefore, the professors would have to consider the economic impact of continuing to fight against an opponent who has apparently unlimited resources at his disposal courtesy of the taxpayers of Mississippi.

You ask what service the professors provided. It is clear that for once Thames was shown in public to be a vindictive and spiteful person. I think that Thames has been able to get away with his petty actions for too long because he is a bully and a tyrant, but just smart enough to stay below the public radar. The hearings would not have occurred if the professors hadn't chosen to stand up and if their supporters hadn't rallied to the cause. This web site if full of stories of Thames' similar treatment of others that, for whatever reason, did not generate the same firestorm.

I don't expect that anyone here is going to change your mind. If you are happy with Dr. Thames, that's fine. But if you really believe that Dr. Thames will be able to have a productive impact on USM going forward after all that has gone on lately and during his presidency and his treatment of anyone who disagrees with him, you just are not looking at the situation objectively.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Frank and Gary surely did what was best for themselves in this agreement. They provided for their families while they have an opportunity to seek employment elsewhere. However, they will be gone from USM in two years (or sooner). They were not reinstated as we had hoped for. They will be gone Shelby will still be here.

The issue for those staying at USM is what to do now. Other than having to wait and pay for the two profs to leave, Shelby lost nothing. He even got a commitment from them not to criticize the administration in public.

The message to the remaining faculty is that those who criticize the Thames administration will not be working here long. Faculty Senators beware.

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: concerned
"I'm hearing rumors as well, and they are definatly about them retiring, matter of fact I hear that Frank and Gary invited a few friends over to celebrate after the hearing."

That is total bull$hit

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: Shelby's Right
"I would love for one of you great thinkers to please explain what "great service" G&S have done for USM by all the discontent they have caused through their wrong actions. As it does appear that G&S have agreed to retire, as Dr. Thames had encouraged them to do back in March, it does appear to acknowledge that Anderson must have explained to them yesterday that based on Shelby's evidence that they, G&S, would most likly not prevail in this matter. In short their actions have been wrong! All of you G&S supporters have claimed what a fair and just person Anderson represents (and I agree completely). Well, G&S are going and Shelby remains based on the agreement Anderson help design. Looks like in the end Shelby's right! "

Are you so thick-skulled that you didn't realize that the hearing and the agreement only pertained to GARY and FRANK'S employment? The status of Shelby's employment will be considered soon, don't you fret.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Moving On
"Frank and Gary surely did what was best for themselves in this agreement. They provided for their families while they have an opportunity to seek employment elsewhere. However, they will be gone from USM in two years (or sooner). They were not reinstated as we had hoped for. They will be gone Shelby will still be here. The issue for those staying at USM is what to do now. Other than having to wait and pay for the two profs to leave, Shelby lost nothing. He even got a commitment from them not to criticize the administration in public. The message to the remaining faculty is that those who criticize the Thames administration will not be working here long. Faculty Senators beware. "

Do you really think Thames wasn't admonished for his actions by Anderson? Come on, these distinguished professors had the credentials and respect from colleagues etc. to not resign in early March. Why would they want to remain on campus and work around Little Napoleon? Lawsuits are painful - having your integrity questioned by unethical people is painful -- having your names put out there and being accused of criminal behavior when it didn't amount to that whether you are right or wrong leads to sleepless nights, and many other what-if factors. These men prevailed. SFT won nothing, and I think the fact that Dumb Klumb wasn't there today speaks volumes. BTW - they can't criticize, but the rest of us can.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Shelby's Right
"I would love for one of you great thinkers to please explain what "great service" G&S have done for USM by all the discontent they have caused through their wrong actions. As it does appear that G&S have agreed to retire, as Dr. Thames had encouraged them to do back in March, it does appear to acknowledge that Anderson must have explained to them yesterday that based on Shelby's evidence that they, G&S, would most likly not prevail in this matter. In short their actions have been wrong! All of you G&S supporters have claimed what a fair and just person Anderson represents (and I agree completely). Well, G&S are going and Shelby remains based on the agreement Anderson help design. Looks like in the end Shelby's right! "

They didn't agree to retire. So, what other non-arguments do you have to throw around in your last-grasp attempts to discredit 2 fine professors?

In the end, Shelby is wrong, wrong, wrong. Watch for his resignation soon.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Could be soon...as far as I know, the College Board is still in session...they released the settlement and went back in.

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: alum
"G & S have no problem with taxpayers paying - they approved the agreement"

Your attempt to spin this back on the professors is so funny! If the evil little eavesdropping gnome were any kind of administrator, he wouldn't be facing six lawsuits right now, would he?

Yep, your taxpayer dollars are being spent to clean up Shelby's bogus charade. Don't blame the profs--Shelby brought this on himself!

Date: Apr 30, 2004

The conversations must have been intense (3 hours) and the IHL board involved. Only thing that makes sense: ST is going on vacation in Texas. Sorry Texas.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Moving On
"The issue for those staying at USM is what to do now. Other than having to wait and pay for the two profs to leave, Shelby lost nothing. "

What to do now is to keep the pressure on until SFT is gone from the dome. Shelby lost a whole lot in this fiasco...his "cloak of invisibility" (we all now know that he is monitoring emails), his credibility as a leader and administrator, and, apparently, his own freakin' mind. I'll bet Gary and Frank could get jobs at any university now. And I'll also bet that any other university (with the exception of online ones) wouldn't touch Shelby with a 100-ft. pole right now. Now, who's lost something?

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: sport
"The conversations must have been intense (3 hours) and the IHL board involved. Only thing that makes sense: ST is going on vacation in Texas. Sorry Texas."

Don't mess with Texas.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by: Moving On
"Other than having to wait and pay for the two profs to leave, Shelby lost nothing. He even got a commitment from them not to criticize the administration in public. The message to the remaining faculty is that those who criticize the Thames administration will not be working here long. Faculty Senators beware. "

Shelby lost a huge amount. Perhaps he was not publicly tarred and feathered, but he was publicly embarassed by our viewing of his weak case, by our clearer insight to his spiteful mission and invasive tactics, and by our widespread awareness of his now much discussed failed presidency. Remember that the limited scope of the hearing was about termination. From that standpoint, professors Glamser and Stringer won. I, too, would have loved to see the professors receive more but I also feel that they lone, in consultation with their attorneys, were ENTITLED to make the right decision for themselves and their families. They did their part. They have been taking the public hits for months. Shelby has been weakened; his administration has been weakened; the faculty who remain are going to take this university back and are going to do it with shared governance and transparency. Keep going Faculty Senate - phase two.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Yes, I do apologize to Texas, which, by the way, would crush ST under a Tony Lama in about 5 minutes.

Date: Apr 30, 2004

quote:
Originally posted by:
"The status of Shelby's employment will be considered soon, don't you fret."

Thanks for reminding me, FS. In my initial disgust with the settlement, I neglected to think that through.

However, I don't see the in-coming board president as being very willing to entertain consideration of anything but Shelby's continued employment as president of the University of Southern Mississippi. I hope I'm wrong, but I don't think I am.

My heart goes out to USM faculty, particularly those who are "marked" men & women right now for being vocal in their support of Glamser & Stringer. The only advice I have is to keep your resume' ready & your options open. You can rest assured that Thames has made careful notes about "where he went wrong" with this case; he will not repeat the same mistakes twice. He will devise a more efficient way to can those who disagree with him.

Now, if you'll excuse me, I have three diplomas I want to take off my wall. It makes me sick to look at them

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: sport
"Yes, I do apologize to Texas, which, by the way, would crush ST under a Tony Lama in about 5 minutes. "

Off topic, but if you think Tony Lamas would do some damage, check out Rocketbusters. www.rocketbusters.com

Date: Apr 30, 2004

Oklahoma sits ABOVE Texas via the Red River

Fire Shelby · Status: Offline

quote:
Originally posted by: educator
"Oklahoma sits ABOVE Texas via the Red River"

That's right!

Date: Apr 30, 2004

I have been as guilty as alot of people in speculation about the settlement. Yea, I'd imagined G&S back in their offices, termination proceeding stopped, Shelby fired with a big tattoo placed on his forehead that read "Pig's Ass" (no offense to pigs), a perfect iterim president named and a national search announced, maybe a good monetary settlement to cover the profs' legal fees coming out of Shelby's pocket, good headlines and sighs of relief from faculty and students. But that's fantasy and the settlement results are real, but not bad by a long shot.
G&S have won this round, for themselves and this is good for all of us. Their case has proved that Shelby had none, despite the admin's bluff that "the facts will all come out". Sure, they don't have offices, but they're still here for all intents and purposes. No termination. No grounds for termination. That's what we have been saying since March 5, right?
Since this was to be an open hearing, and since the IHL already accepted the settlement, that means that all of the evidence for the open hearing should now be open and available. Let's see what else is there that Shelby & Co. might not have wanted aired in a cross examination.
Shelby hasn't won the battle and he won't win the war. In addition to everything he did in the two years before trying to fire G&S, he's lost university funding, he's lost some of our best faculty. Worse for him, he's lost credibility. He has openly admitted to screening supposedly private correspondence. He publicly attacked fabulous student's ethics credibility. He's attacked so many members of the press that I can't even remember all of their names. Instead of doing the job of a university president, he has lashed out at evryone who has criticized him. He can't be the president anymore. No more benefit of the doubt, no more devil's advocate. Shelby burned those bridges at USM long ago... with gasoline and a flamethrower.